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 Large MTTs Pre flop and Flop play mid stage

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kanlund



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PostSubject: Large MTTs Pre flop and Flop play mid stage   Wed Aug 26, 2009 8:00 am

Large MTTs Pre flop and Flop play mid stage

We should never pay attention to how much people have won in games they have played before, whit checking stats etc. It is Better to look at the respective tourney u are playing, how they are playing and take it from there (table reads).

First thing I look at in tourneys are VPIP (voluntary put money in pot), then the pre flop raise this is the 2 most important information you can get at the table, the closer the pre flop raise is compare to the VPIP then better the player often is. This is the first things that we have to focus at, and try to not be the caller but the raiser. Second is on flop and same rule here, whit a 60-75% pot bet.

If players do this good means those players understand the important of positions then cards will be second and range will get auto then the VPIP will be auto adjusted and u want to end up at 16 VPIP overall (Not to tight and not to lose).

The Turn card is when your cards get more important. So we will always will be risking close to a pot size of our stack at flop

This is also the reason for to adjust the pre flop raise to 2.2 X BB when Big Blinds gets to 300 and higher, so you have room to bet 2/3 pot size at flop, without risking too many chips and have the option to fold for a a reraise.

If play a weak player and he/she is in position at flop and bet 1/3 pot size it will often be profit to re raise, reason for this is that bets at flop lower than 50% often is a sign of a weak player and better players will often take advantage and re raise (We will then be the weak player) often good players that pay attention look at your flop bet regardless they are in pot or not so they can paint a picture what kind of a player we are.

Often in free rolls people don’t understand this so much but in buying for 11 dollar and up many players are skilled and see your play. Let’s say its 4 good players at your table included yourself this players will often respect eathothers bets because all 4 of them will often advance in the tourney in generally this means overall a advance for this players especially in mid stage of the game, there is also very difficult put this players on a range because standard pre flop play and standard flop bets.

When are short stacked: Personally I don’t like small stack play down to 10BB because can be a false safety line for many players and end up here too often in the long run, so adjust this to 15BB+. The fact is that the big money often is at 18 places or better in large MTTs.

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Last edited by kanlund on Mon Sep 28, 2009 1:48 pm; edited 8 times in total
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MischiefMarg
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PostSubject: Good read   Wed Aug 26, 2009 8:17 am

I read thru this and understand and try to do this but find only in middle / late stages this can be applied.

Early in game, betting patterns change immensely.

Being used to being a small stack when deep in tourny, I struggle to hold to the 10 x bb rule and try to keep my head above water lol!!!

I'll keep trying Smile

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MurryTheCat
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PostSubject: Re: Large MTTs Pre flop and Flop play mid stage   Thu Aug 27, 2009 1:32 am

Good post Kan Cool Thanks for the insight. My tears keep ruining my laptops, perhaps this could save me some money Laughing
I find it extremely hard to read players online, mainly because I don't try hard enough. There simply are to many distractions. I do try to study how they formulate there bets in relation to the pot. Also how they react to what I perceive as a weak play.
I agree with you about letting that stack bleed down, most games are top heavy with payouts. I try to always keep an eye on what next blind level is when I am under 20 BBs, it is easy to think your okay and then it jumps up on you.
Sometimes I sit back to long Twisted Evil
Very good advice Sir Wink

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flash13



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PostSubject: Re: Large MTTs Pre flop and Flop play mid stage   Thu Aug 27, 2009 11:22 am

Howdy....Great read .....Make me think about giving up poker...To must to think about when u play that game....Its geting to the point where its not fun anymore ...take care all gl in all u do peaceout....

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kanlund



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PostSubject: Re: Large MTTs Pre flop and Flop play mid stage   Sat Aug 29, 2009 6:38 am

MischiefMarg wrote:
I read thru this and understand and try to do this but find only in middle / late stages this can be applied.

Early in game, betting patterns change immensely.

Being used to being a small stack when deep in tourny, I struggle to hold to the 10 x bb rule and try to keep my head above water lol!!!

I'll keep trying Smile
Early in the game is important to build up a table image. The most important here is that u try not play a naked game, try use standard bets pre flop adjust this to 3 BB pre flop raise, for myself often from UTG and utg+1 can often use 4-5 BB pre flop raise whit a big hand like KK AA, this for try not get so many calers and offcourse if get raised 3bet and try get A.

At flop 2/3 pot bet, this when are HU at flop.

Problem often early is that can be more then 2 at flop often and then not so easy play the flop as aggressive as u want. But tight trapping strategy can be good. My goal first hour is to double my stack, for to meet the blinds hour 2.

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Last edited by kanlund on Sat Aug 29, 2009 10:38 am; edited 1 time in total
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kanlund



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PostSubject: Re: Large MTTs Pre flop and Flop play mid stage   Sat Aug 29, 2009 7:00 am

MurryTheCat wrote:
Good post Kan Cool Thanks for the insight. My tears keep ruining my laptops, perhaps this could save me some money Laughing
I find it extremely hard to read players online, mainly because I don't try hard enough. There simply are to many distractions. I do try to study how they formulate there bets in relation to the pot. Also how they react to what I perceive as a weak play.
I agree with you about letting that stack bleed down, most games are top heavy with payouts. I try to always keep an eye on what next blind level is when I am under 20 BBs, it is easy to think your okay and then it jumps up on you.
Sometimes I sit back to long Twisted Evil
Very good advice Sir Wink
Yes not so easy get the table reads online, but we learn the game very good online, this is a way to focus on game 100%, and when use this betting strategy, you force yourself to play a tighter pre flop and more aggressive at flop for to do this you are forced to collect table reads.
When we have a game plan I think the game gets more interesting, and this way easier to see the progress in our games.

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kanlund



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PostSubject: Re: Large MTTs Pre flop and Flop play mid stage   Sat Aug 29, 2009 7:11 am

flash13 wrote:
Howdy....Great read .....Make me think about giving up poker...To must to think about when u play that game....Its geting to the point where its not fun anymore ...take care all gl in all u do peaceout....
Giving up poker is not a option you have lol. Personally when try have game plan make the game more interesting and to see how other players play and think is learning. Use the positions and all benefit we have in the game is Poker. Peaceout (-:

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MurryTheCat
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PostSubject: Re: Large MTTs Pre flop and Flop play mid stage   Sat Aug 29, 2009 6:19 pm

Live I lean back sip my beer and look str8 into there soul Laughing Online I have MSN, Yahoo, 2 televisions, Murray meowing for food Shocked A Jehovahs Witness at the door (relax it's a joke ) laundry to fold and I am on the phone. Oh and I am probably in n obscure 2nd game. Also trying to recover from accidentally calling a 3x raise with 4-7 while reaching for my chicken hero. Rolling Eyes

Ahhhhhhhhhh affraid affraid All kidding aside there is so much to factor in and so much info to garner every hand if you pay attention. And your right about learning to play online, you see every situation so mant times that by the time your in a casino you know it cold

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